Three Questions

24 Responses to “Three Questions”

1. lucy Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 10:02 am

   I had the same thoughts about Snape! I can't WAIT for the next book to see if we're right.

2. LMB Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 10:08 am

   I can't believe it's almost over! But I look forward to having many questions answered.

3. Trish Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 10:13 am

   1. My son got the first book as a prize in a library reading program a few years ago. He was interested in the others after that. I read them so that I could discuss them with him, and eventually got interested myself. I still don't like the movies, though.
   2. My first reaction was, "Oh, no, how disappointing." I didn't think these were the "teenagers know more than adults" type of books–so far they hadn't been–and suddenly this? Then I read it more carefully. I tend to agree with you on it. I don't think Dumbledore's "iron-clad" reason for trusting Snape was just because he SAID he'd reformed, but that's what Harry seems to believe. Much misdirection here, I'm thinking.
   3. At this point I honestly don't know.

4. lucy Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 10:22 am

   1. About the time Order of the Phoenix came out, I swung by the library and got a copy of The Sorcerer's Stone. I was totally hooked and read the first four books. So I was not along since the beginning, but have been for about three or for years now. I wish it didn't take so long for each book to come out, but you can't force art!
   2. See my answer above.
   3. I've got Deathly Hallows on order at the library. In my previous experience, the book becomes available for pickup very soon after the release (a few days). I don't read HP analysis sites (well, except this one) and I will avoid any literary blogs as well (last time I read some famous book blog - I think it was Maud Newton - and they gave away Dumbledore's death before HP was released. Not only was the spoiler cavalierly posted with no warning, it was done in order to insult the series. I was p*ssed. I haven't visited the site again.

5. Miss Ladybug Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 10:45 am

   My best friend got me reading the Harry Potter books a while back (we were still roommates, so some time between '96 and '98). She has pre-ordered #7 for me for my birthday in July.

6. Eva Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 10:54 am

   1) How/when did you become a Harry Potter fan?

   It was very gradual for me. As a Christian, I was wary of Harry Potter and his "magic," and I wasn't really into what I thought was adolescent fantasy fiction, even though I'd devoured CS Lewis' Narnia books while in college.

   We ended up renting a video of the Sorcerer's Stone in 2000 sometime, I think. I thought it was cute, pretty well done, and fairly harmless. So when Chamber of Secrets came out, we went to the theater to see it. I was disappointed and shocked at how dark it had gotten, compared to Sorcerer's Stone. Still hadn't gotten into the books and so had no clue what to expect. I was turned off at that point.

   During this time, I worked for a Wiccan and avoided anything that rang of witchcraft or magic like a plague. She enjoyed Harry Potter and spoke well of the books, but that served to dampen my appetite for them even more.

   A while later, before Prisoner of Azkaban came out as a movie, my new boss, whom I really love and respect, just encouraged me to give them a read. She let me borrow her Sorcerer's Stone and Chamber of Secrets. Once I started in, I couldn't stop. It was like I was feeding on something I needed. I read my Bible regularly, but this was a narrative form of something I knew I needed. But the magic and such still had me a little uneasy.

   I made my way through all 5 books talking about them as little as possible with other Christians (many of whom scowled and pursed their lips), waited in line at the theater to see Prisoner of Azkaban and Goblet of Fire, bought Half-Blood Prince as soon as it was out and sped through it. I've now read Sorcerer's Stone and Chamber of Secrets 3 times; and PoA, GoF, OoP, and HBP twice, with a third read in progress before Deathly Hallows comes out.

   All the while, I had a hard time reconciling the magic with my faith. Then I read about John Granger on your site, LaShawn. I picked up "Looking for God in Harry Potter," and as I read it, I felt all of my reservations melt away and my love for Harry Potter confirmed and explained. I hadn't known why I felt the way I did about these books until I read Granger's, and that put the pieces together for me.

   2) What was your first reaction (physical and/or mental) when you read the scene in which Snape killed Dumbledore?

   "No, no, no, no. Impossible. No. Huh-uh. Uh-uh. No way. No. Stop. He didn't. How could he? What the…? I don't… No. Absolutely not." Okay, so that was the initial reaction. I know, logically, that because Voldemort can get into Harry's head that it is critical that Harry believe Snape is 100% pure evil, just so Voldemort believes it too. And since we see everything through Harry's perspective, that's how it's shown to us on the surface. But I feel like I'm looking at it as I'll look at life/humanity/everything when I get to Heaven — as if "through a glass darkly," as 1 Cor. says, sort of like through a fun-house wavy mirror. Things aren't clear. We don't know everything. We've got limited perspective and understanding. I just know there's more to this, something huge missing. I'm holding my breath that Rowling gives us enough in Deathly Hallows that I'm satisfied. But it's almost like the thirst for heaven here — I want to know all, understand all, see it all, get it all. Even if she does give us everything she can, my perspective and opinions and reactions will probably hold me back from fully understanding this. I'll need to re-read the whole 7 books a few more times to get it as much as I'm able, I'm sure. She packs so darned much into each one that I'm not convinced I'll ever pick up on every bit of it. And sometimes those little bits can change your entire understanding. Okay, enough of that. Moving on…

   3) How/when will you read Deathly Hallows?

   I need to pre-order it so I can read it immediately. I'll probably take a day or two off of work — yes, I might. Curl up on the couch with some snacks and a big glass of water and neglect my husband and puppy for as long as it takes. I'll probably go without sleep, too. And space out my bathroom breaks as far as possible. I'm voracious and ridiculous when it comes to things like this. When I get started, I just can't stop. I've got a booklight that I use in bed so I don't keep my husband up. He understands. I just hope I don't hurt the puppy's feelings! She'll only be a little over 4 months old when Deathly Hallows comes out…

7. LMB Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 11:07 am

   Eva, I'm so glad I influenced you to read Granger's work. I, too, was uneasy about the books for a long time, and while watching "Sorcerer's Stone," I felt like I was doing something wrong.

   Even before I heard of Granger, I came to understand that the books were edifying and that reading them was in no way akin to practicing sorcery. I respect the boundries of Christians who believe reading books like HP are forbidden and would never try to argue that they should read the books. If they truly believe it's wrong, I can't/won't be a stumbling block.

   Your Deathly Hallows reading plan sounds great!

8. Jud Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 11:28 am

   1) I saw the first movie shortly after it came out but wasn't that impressed. Fast forward to 2005 and the hype surrounding book 6. I figured I might as well give the books a shot. It didn't take long before I was hooked; I ripped through all 6 books in about a month.

   2) Unfortunately I was spoiled, but not by design. Some shmuck posted "snape kills dumbledore" in a completely unrelated forum that I frequent. I was really upset about it.

   3) I'm hoping to go to a midnight release party and have the whole thing read by the time I show up to work the next day. That's the plan at least. Hopefully I'll be able to avoid spoilers.

9. Eva Says:
   May 11th, 2007 at 1:37 pm

   LaShawn,

   It's so funny now — when I'm talking to another Christian about the books and the whole issue of witchcraft/sorcery and how it jives (or doesn't) with our faith comes up, and I start talking about incantational vs. invocational magic and what the scriptures say about them, how they translate into reality, and then into the book, and then the classical symbolism of names, colors, etc., I often get a look as if I've got 3 heads!

   I also try to respect their boundaries — it's like we're told in the New Testament (though I'm forgetting the specific reference) that different people may have different limitations and boundaries, and if reading Harry Potter bolsters and affirms my faith, bully for me. But if it's a stumbling block to others, they should steer clear of it. Not that that concept should be used to excuse anything sinful…

   I've found very few other Christians who are both as intrigued and as touched by these books. I'm always so eager to gobble up all of the discussion you facilitate here! It gives me my faith-based HP fix! Thank you!

10. Margaret Says:
    May 11th, 2007 at 2:45 pm

    1. I became a fan sometime after the 4th book was already out and read them all and started chomping at the bit for the next installment. My oldest daughter, my oldest son, my youngest son and I are totally geeky Harry fans. We have read nearly every book written about Harry and Rowling out there. We go to the B & N midnight parties in order to get our books ASAP. This year, in honor of the end of the series, I plan to thoroughly embarress my children by dressing as Mrs. Weasley. I have read curly hair and can do a flawless Brit accent, so the B & N booksellers call me Mrs. Weasley already anyway.!

    2. When Dumbledore died, I sobbed. I could barely read the rest of the book for the tears. I still cry with each reread. Then my next reaction was disbelief. "Surely he'll pull a Gandalf," I said to myself. Sadly JKR has said that Dumby is definitely dead. So much for that. After the sadness and disbelief, I am now in the angry stage of grieving because Dumby is without a doubt my favoritest character, well before Harry. I will miss him if he doesn't somehow appear in DH.

    3. We will rush home from B & N. Because we have all had arguments over who is going to get to read first, it has been decided that Mom will read aloud until I collapse exhausted on the couch. We'll wake up and continue until we are done. Then my oldest son will probably want an immediate reread so I will relinquish physical possession of the book to him. When he is finished. I will probably get in a reread before my oldest daughter. Then the little boy, because he is so low on the totem pole can have the book!..

    Can't Wait, Can't Wait, Can't Wait…..:)

11. Stella! Says:
    May 12th, 2007 at 10:52 pm

    I first started reading them in about 2000. My friend loaned her collection of the first four to me and told me to keep them as long as I needed. I returned them 4 days later. I probably would have returned them sooner but I took time away from reading to work and study. OOP was pre ordered and read the first weekend day I had it. HBP got sent to my parents'house because it came out 3 weeks before my wedding and I had to get some work done so that I could afford the timeoff for the wedding. I started it in the airport on the way to the honeymoon and had finished it by the time the plane landed.

    Someone in the office told me that Dumbledore died, but wouldn't tell me how, so my first thought when I read it was Snape? What exactly is the nature of the vow he took at spinner's end? Now I am left wondering about Snape's redemption, and Draco's redemption. I think it is a definite possibilty. I also think that Harry's ability to love and forgive will be important, if not crucial.

    I have preordered the book and if I receive it on a weekend day (which I am supposed to), I will turn the ac down, make a pot of strong tea and have some animal crackers with nutella (just in case dementors attack) put on my favorite pajamas and read the book. I am, after all, a bit obsessive about Harry Potter.

12. shadowquill Says:
    May 15th, 2007 at 3:39 pm

    1. I became a fan when the books were just beginning to gain media attention. The second book had come out fairly recently, and a very close friend of mine lent the first to me. I absolutely loved it, and went on to the second. I eagerly anticipated the third, and I grabbed all the information on it that the publishers had released. (I remember some kids' magazine released the chapter in which Trelawney predicts Harry's death. I guess things weren't as "top secret" back then.)

    I was ridiculously tormented by the religious controversies that arose, never mind the other children's fantasy stories that I had loved (Narnia, Lord of the Rings, Prydain, Redwall, etc.) and never questioned. I never saw any evil in the series until the debate began, and I couldn't figure out why the adults were having difficulty differentiating between reality and fantasy. I became obsessively concerned and wasted a lot of time beating myself over the head. All I can say is, I wish I'd found John Granger's book sooner. It would have saved me a lot of stress! The real problem I had was that I believed Harry Potter was good, therefore if it was bad, that would make me bad too! It was very juvenile logic, but that was how I thought at the time. It's easy to be irrational when you're frightened.

    2. Like many other commenters said, I went "WHAT!?" and reread. After rereading it about three or four times I just sat there with the book open in my lap, digesting (painfully) the reality that had just begun to sink in. I questioned why Snape would do such a thing. It seemed to have been a very suspicious decision, not to mention how he technically disobeyed Voldemort by executing Draco's task. Months later I found the "Snape is good" theories online and realized why it seemed such a quirky decision on his part. I've now decided he is either a Machiavelli and out for himself, or Dumbledore's man through and through.

    3. I will read Deathly Hallows the first day it is out. I will load a tray up with cheese and crackers, a salad maybe, and some coffee, and then hole myself up in my room until I'm done. I won't rush it, though. If I have to, I'll read it late in the day Sunday too. I don't want to rush it, and yet I really don't want to overhear any spoilers. I won't watch t.v. I won't go online. Avoid spoilers at all cost!

13. Danica Says:
    May 16th, 2007 at 4:37 pm

    1. I think I started reading them soon after the first one came out. I was just starting high school at the time and my mom had bought the book for us. It's been a long time so I don't really remember but I know that I had read them prior to the movies and I think we read them as they came out, even before all of the hype.

    2. I think I was just really surprised at it.

    3. As for when I will read Deathly Hallows, I have pre-ordered it. However, it is part of my husband's birthday present (it comes out the day afterwards) so he gets to read it first. I'm also letting him read it first since he waited for a week to read HBP since his aunt was giving it to him on his birthday. My sister read HBP first since we had been in FL for some weddings the day it came out. It will probably be some late nights for me, or have to wait till the next weekend.

14. Trish Says:
    May 16th, 2007 at 7:29 pm

    Here's what my local library has planned (I am trying not to cringe as I report this):

    A Harry Potter Lock-In.

    Here's the actual description:

    "Starting at 7:00 p.m. on July 20, and ending at 7:00 a.m. the following morning, teens will eat pizza, watch Harry Potter movies on a big screen, play Hogwarts-certified games (no, not Quidditch), and more, all night long." The participants are encouraged to dress in costume, for prizes, and can pay in advance to receive the new book at midnight.

    Note that this is a lock-in, i.e. no one can leave before 7 a. m. even if they want to.

    It sounds innocuous enough, doesn't it? This is why I am upset:

    Harry Potter fans span the generations. This is an almost unprecedented opportunity to bring younger children, teenagers, and adults together . But, no, we can't have that. We must lock the teenagers away from their siblings and their parents. At my library, no adults or children need apply . Harry Potter is for teenagers only, and adults don't even get to know what is being said or done.

    I can't imagine what sort of parents would allow their teenager to be locked in all night with only other teenagers (and perhaps a government employee or two–the literature doesn't say) present. Remember that "teen" spans the years from 13-19. Thank God my son is not there yet, but when he is, I don't want him spending an entire night with other teenagers and only a librarian in charge.

15. LMB Says:
    May 17th, 2007 at 5:13 am

    I agree, Trish. A lock-in? How odd. I understand what they're trying to do, but the approach is off.

16. Trish Says:
    May 19th, 2007 at 6:13 pm

    I know they're just trying to appeal to young readers, but you're right, this isn't the correct approach. It possibly disturbs me more than it should, because my son is 12 and right on the edge of the age group they're aiming at.

    Well, we've pre-ordered the book, and my son is over the moon about it. But it's MY belated birthday present, and I get it first! (Thanks to my terrific hubby.)

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    May 23rd, 2007 at 12:29 am

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18. Merlin Says:
    May 24th, 2007 at 12:44 pm

    1.
    I devoured books 1-4 for the first time in the early summer of the year that #5 was released (2003). Then I had a copy of #5 in my hands and I said "I must be strong … I need to pass this intensive (12 credits in 10 weeks) course in Latin before I let my self read it," but needless to say the night before the Latin final I had just hit page 700 or so of book 5, and still pulled out an A- on the exam. In the early days, when I had not read the books but only heard of them, and I was not a "Harry-Hater" but did think "snotty little brat", I remember thinking "heh heh, I bet Jackson and Lord of the Rings are kicking Potter's little magical backside in the boxoffice." And then I found that my friend's oldest kid was really into them and that his wife was too, from reading them alongside her son (Josh is now 14 and his 12 yr old sister Elizabeth will occassionally rip back through OotP or HBP in a weekend if I have been at their house and talking about something in one of those books that she does not remember clearly) … so I said "well, should at least check them out, I guess, I don't think I'll be terribly impressed but it'll probably make it a little harder to rip on them, so that is good" … and the rest, as they say, is history.

    2.
    When the green light special flew on top of the tower, I think my heart stopped for a second the way it did the one time I was reading Lord of the Rings and Frodo and Sam are going thourgh Mordor and Tolkien has this great final placement of a line in a chapter: Frodo falls into a crater that they can hide and rest in, and "there he lay - like a dead thing." (it just has a very final feel that really hits you when it is the last line in a chapter like that). I think the AK from Snape knocked the wind out of me in the same way as that line.

    3.
    I am currently live in the Bronx borough of NYC and it only takes me about a 45 minute to an hour commute to be at Union Square/14th and Broadway area. Thus on July 20th sometime in the evening I will load my backpack with some reading material and my MA gown for my "costume" (the cheepo one that came with the hood … the MA gown I really value is that I inherited from my father … it's heavier and nicer too , from back in the day when an MA meant something and so you got a good gown to go with it lol) - I will hop the 4 train at Fordham rd and Jerome Ave (or actually, depending on price, it might just as easy to hop the Metro North to , it'll definitely be quicker and more scenic) …
    And then I will don my gown, and join the throngs at the Barnes and Noble at Union Square for the best, most authentic midnight release in the US

    (I mean, I'm from Pittsburgh area and I love lots of other places in the country very dearly … but there is no place quite like the apple - I mean, if Rowkling is going to do a reading in the states, it's not going to be at the LA Convention center or Disney World in FL, or even Ceasar's Palace or the Bellagio in Vegas … it's going to be at Radio City Music Hall, just around the corner from St Patrick's Cathedral, where I went to confession the other day, just a few blocks south of Central Park [gotta love the smell of horse manure in the summer - watch where you plant your Nikes lol] , Columbus circle on the west side and Macy's on 5th Ave on the East … in NYC).

    Then I will ride whatever train I will ride back up to the Bronx (probably the Metro-North if it is running, simply because it is much closer to my apt and the less a white boy like me walks home on Fordham rd at 3am the better, even if he does have a big red beard) and stay up reading till either I have to go to work or till I simply collapse lol.

    I think I shall devour it quickly (taking notes) and then make a weekend trip back to my home town so that I can allow my friend and his son and daughter and wife to have an extra copy for the weekend to defray the stress of all 4 of them vying for the same copy and having to wait in line to read it.

    Merlin the Meandering

19. Merlin Says:
    May 24th, 2007 at 1:00 pm

    PS, forgot to mention … on your reading of the "Severus … Severus … Please" line, I pretty much agree … accept that if it really is full out murder, I don't think that DD begging SS not to kill him is exactly the same as DD being afraid to die … DD is a wise man and knows that the real damage, if it is the prima facia murder thing, is not to himself, but to Snape's soul. When he tells Draco that Draco is not a killer and 'let's have no more pretense about you going to kill me" kind of thing, it is a statement of a positive aspect of Draco, not being able to do it is a vritue, but the situation is different with Snape … good Snape or bad Snape, he is still somebody capable of actually pulling the trigger in a way that Draco, to his credit, was not able to do.

    Like I said, I am, at least until the final evidence is in this summer, of the opinion with yours that DD was asking Snape to go through with the deed that he actually did go through with. I just wanted to point out that there would be other possible readings of "please don't kill me" - other than fear of death (namely the fear of further moral damage to the person doing the killing, who DD cares about personally).

20. Trish Says:
    May 26th, 2007 at 5:21 pm

    Merlin–
    Good point about Snape and the other possible reading, but I don't think Dumbledore would have said it the way he said it if that was what he meant. He'd have said, "Don't do this to yourself," or something similar. That's keeping in mind what he actually did say to Draco.

21. Sword of Gryffindor Says:
    May 29th, 2007 at 10:49 pm

    LaShawn Barber posted these three questions as a discussion-starter at Fantasy Fiction for Christians, and I thought I'd get the discussion going here as well…

22. Quadrivium Says:
    May 31st, 2007 at 3:44 pm

    I’ve meant to write about this for a while, and thanks to FFC and the Sword of Gryffindor, I have a good excuse. 

23. Merlin Says:
    June 13th, 2007 at 4:56 pm

    I realize this is a LONG time after the original post and even after my comment (been a busy busy time). I finally hopped back around here

    Trish, I can see your point but I also tend to think along the lines of "less is more." In other words I still think it possible for that other reading to be there and not be painted so prominently 'on the sleeve' so to speak. This is for a number of reasons. One is the actual "less is more" of dialog writing, kind of like in Tombstone when Val Kilmer winks at the guy in the OK corral and starts the gunfight … there is a lot in that wink that takes the guy a second to register and then his facial expression says "oh sh…!" because he realizes that Kilmer is telling him he is going to make it real, no more pussy-footing around and chesting up (there are some GREAT animated parodies out there of the third star wars prequels that function as parodies precisely on the "more is less" principle and lack of necessary ambivalence in Lucas' horrendously painful dialog writing). Tied to that is the whole use of ambiguity .Finally, tied to the whole ambiguity thing is the whole narrative misdirection and things going on behind the scenes etc that Granger and other have been talking about.

    In other words, I disagree with you on the conclusiveness of DD not saying those exact and tight words you talked about, but I think in doing so you did exactly the thing Rowling is going for in the experience of these books, which I mean positively … in truth I would not want to be one of the people who, when book 7 comes out, says "oh yes, well I sort of saw that all coming and really didn't even have to think that hard about it, it was pretty obvious" because that way of life is boring as all get out - more fun to agonize and ponder and do some mental gymnastics wondering and then be surprised by where Rowling takes it in the end, and actually probably have a more involved and meaningful grasp of where she takes it precisely because of having agonized about it

24. Trish Says:
    June 17th, 2007 at 4:36 pm

    Merlin–
    I was thinking about this as a writer, not a reader, and I have to disagree. Rowling uses words very precisely (look at all those cleverly researched names), and while she is also a master of misdirection, I think in this case the misdirection would go the other way.